Murdering an abortion provider is obviously inexcusable and horrific, but all the expressions of liberal glee over the murderer's conviction and life sentence are disquieting. If a human must be locked up, the least we can do is be sad about it.
Oh cmon. All those posts said were, essentially, "good" and I think it was pretty clear they weren't as much thrilled by the whole situation as they were relieved that the alternative, the jury finding him not guilty as jury nullification and it setting off a wave of vigilante murders, didn't happen. Maybe a shade more gravitas was called for, but that's still a long way from glee.
It's not that I necessarily want something different to be done with him, but it's just yet another expression of the general love of punishment that American progressives seem to have in such abundance. I think it is a terrible tragedy whenever a human being is sent to prison, particularly for life, and while in our society as it exists now it may sometimes be more desirable than the alternative (and if ever there has been such a case, this is one), it is never something to be celebrated.
Maybe you're right. I chose Melissa McEwan, Tristero, and PZ Myers because a) they're the people who annoy me regularly enough, in such an amusing way, that I read them frequently, so they're the posts I saw, and b) the similar wording of all three, and the non-wordiness of them (as opposed to each writers' usual lengthy, professorial declamations), creeped me out.
Normally the three of them go on and on and on about why they think the (often batshit) things they think, but here they felt no need--all right-thinking people will agree, I saw them thinking. What more can be said? There's such a tone of "We're locking up the right people!" to it. Particularly coming from Tristero, who has written long and hard about how awful Mike Huckabee is for releasing people from prison, it's hard to take.
I don't know, maybe what I'm seeing there is entirely a product of my own personal context for each of the writers, and of the fact that I read those three posts in quick succession. I certainly don't mean to defend the murderer. I just don't think that "Good" or "Thank you" is ever the right response to a person's imprisonment.
It could be - god knows I share your dislike of those particular writers, and for many of the same reasons (that and the chiding tone they take - characterizing anyone who disagrees with them as a petulant child), but I think it's probably more likely their lack of wordiness here is from a rush to post something about it. But maybe I'm too generous.
The difference here is that you find the "justice system" itself is a kind of tragedy, wherein locking away a large percentage of the population is the only "solution" to a number of "problems".
I think the writers you reference are more in the camp of a) at least he wasn't tortured/rendered/enemy combatant and b) presumably he will be locked up and therefore unable to repeat his actions (killing doctors).
In their minds, a sentence of being detained for life (or possibly even executed) is the BEST resolution out there, hence the celebrations.
Other people might consider it the "least bad" resolution and therefore be somewhat more muted on their overall glee.
I notice you have more women represented in the comments portion of your blog than anyone else in our entire circle-jerk of proglessive blogs. I can only take from this that whatever you are doing, you are doing it best.
Considering that I owe pretty much all of my commenters to you (and also that I'm not sure I have enough commenters to draw conclusions from), I'm not sure how much credit I can take. Thank you nonetheless.
Also can I ask about your Polanski stance: where do you get the idea that it hasn't been proven? there's testimonial transcripts where the girl confesses Polanski did indeed rape her. And just because she herself doesn't want to be asked about it does not mean it should be abandoned entirely
Honestly I regret much of what I said about that, a great deal of which was said in ignorance and a knee-jerk I-like-his-movies silliness.
I do think it's irritating when people act like Polanski himself confessed (he did plead guilty, but as a plea bargain for a reduced sentence, which bargain was reneged upon by the judge--which is why Polanski fled), or like the horrifying part of the whole thing is that Polanski had sex with a minor (rather than the likelihood that he raped someone, regardless of age). And, again, the delight many people take in punishing people is sickening to me, regardless of what the person has done.
I'm sorry...I really don't feel the need to rehash it any further. Like I said, I think most people's takes on it (mine included) were wrong, in various respects. I sympathize with anyone's urge to avoid imprisonment, and that's all I really have to say about it.
Ethan's working through his music collection in alphabetical order
The next five artists he'll be listening to:
The Clash The Clientele Jimmy Cliff Patsy Cline Clinic
(Project began May 29, 2010. Finished through the letter B on April 1, 2011 with 460 items catalogued on Rate Your Music.)
Ethan's reading
Samuel R. Delany Triton aka Trouble on Triton: An Ambiguous Heterotopia
Thoughts that aren't getting whole posts
- I just caught my cat licking one of my dirty shirts. When he saw I was watching, he pretended he'd been cleaning himself all along. -ethan 9/23/11
- I didn't know The Pixies covered "I've Been Waiting for You"! So on Heathen, David Bowie covered The Pixies AND a song they covered? Weird. -ethan 9/21/11
- Dangerous Visions is so goddamn macho. And like half the writers are military or "intelligence" or government or advertising dudes. It largely bites. -ethan 9/10/11
- I wish people would figure out that "HD" is not even close to "like you're actually there"--it's completely different from how we really see things. If they figured that out, maybe it would occasionally be used interestingly. -ethan 9/9/11
- Robinson Crusoe on Mars has its major problems, but it looks like a series of living Nicholas Roerich paintings. -ethan 9/3/11
- I just plain don't like Brian Aldiss. -ethan 8/31/11
- Here, at least, it was a good hurricane. I'm embarrassed by how happy I was when the electricity came back on. -ethan 8/28/11
- Is it my imagination or is IOZ way more open about genuinely caring about things since his return? -ethan 8/26/11
- Does Firefox constantly tell British people that they're spelling labour and programme and theatre wrong? -ethan 8/25/11
- There is a huge (and hugely important) difference between knowing that events a, b, and c happened between years x and y, and understanding that they were happening at the same time. -ethan 8/24/11
- Among the many things bugging me about the crappy novel I'm reading is that it keeps referring to a woman whose "late teens" were "forty years ago" as a "little old lady." Come on now, she's 59 at the oldest. -ethan 8/22/11
- Spending a day in the woods is the best thing in the world. -ethan 8/21/11
- Maria Mies: "Powerless groups, particularly if they are totally integrated within a system of power and exploitation, find it difficult to define reality differently from the powerful." -ethan 8/20/11
- The funniest sentence in Frankenstein: "I found that I could not compose a female without again devoting several months to profound study and laborious disquisition." -ethan 8/18/11
- Chumbawamba: "Nothing ever burned down by itself/Every fire needs a little bit of help." -ethan 8/18/11
- We'll see if I use this. Idea stolen from Davidly. -ethan 8/18/11
16 comments:
Oh cmon. All those posts said were, essentially, "good" and I think it was pretty clear they weren't as much thrilled by the whole situation as they were relieved that the alternative, the jury finding him not guilty as jury nullification and it setting off a wave of vigilante murders, didn't happen. Maybe a shade more gravitas was called for, but that's still a long way from glee.
Plus it should be "are disquieting"
I agree with the above: what would you rather see be done with him if I may ask?
Thanks, fixed the conjugation.
It's not that I necessarily want something different to be done with him, but it's just yet another expression of the general love of punishment that American progressives seem to have in such abundance. I think it is a terrible tragedy whenever a human being is sent to prison, particularly for life, and while in our society as it exists now it may sometimes be more desirable than the alternative (and if ever there has been such a case, this is one), it is never something to be celebrated.
That's all.
Fair enough, but you need better examples if you're going to pick on specific people.
Maybe you're right. I chose Melissa McEwan, Tristero, and PZ Myers because a) they're the people who annoy me regularly enough, in such an amusing way, that I read them frequently, so they're the posts I saw, and b) the similar wording of all three, and the non-wordiness of them (as opposed to each writers' usual lengthy, professorial declamations), creeped me out.
Normally the three of them go on and on and on about why they think the (often batshit) things they think, but here they felt no need--all right-thinking people will agree, I saw them thinking. What more can be said? There's such a tone of "We're locking up the right people!" to it. Particularly coming from Tristero, who has written long and hard about how awful Mike Huckabee is for releasing people from prison, it's hard to take.
I don't know, maybe what I'm seeing there is entirely a product of my own personal context for each of the writers, and of the fact that I read those three posts in quick succession. I certainly don't mean to defend the murderer. I just don't think that "Good" or "Thank you" is ever the right response to a person's imprisonment.
It could be - god knows I share your dislike of those particular writers, and for many of the same reasons (that and the chiding tone they take - characterizing anyone who disagrees with them as a petulant child), but I think it's probably more likely their lack of wordiness here is from a rush to post something about it. But maybe I'm too generous.
It could be that you're too generous, or it could be that I need to be more generous. Quite likely both.
The difference here is that you find the "justice system" itself is a kind of tragedy, wherein locking away a large percentage of the population is the only "solution" to a number of "problems".
I think the writers you reference are more in the camp of a) at least he wasn't tortured/rendered/enemy combatant and b) presumably he will be locked up and therefore unable to repeat his actions (killing doctors).
In their minds, a sentence of being detained for life (or possibly even executed) is the BEST resolution out there, hence the celebrations.
Other people might consider it the "least bad" resolution and therefore be somewhat more muted on their overall glee.
I think it goes hand in hand with the liberal title.
The people mentioned are so damned used to exalting the least bad alternative that they have no other perspective from which to communicate.
Least bad, yes!
Ethan,
I notice you have more women represented in the comments portion of your blog than anyone else in our entire circle-jerk of proglessive blogs. I can only take from this that whatever you are doing, you are doing it best.
Thanks for leading the way.
Considering that I owe pretty much all of my commenters to you (and also that I'm not sure I have enough commenters to draw conclusions from), I'm not sure how much credit I can take. Thank you nonetheless.
Also can I ask about your Polanski stance: where do you get the idea that it hasn't been proven? there's testimonial transcripts where the girl confesses Polanski did indeed rape her. And just because she herself doesn't want to be asked about it does not mean it should be abandoned entirely
Here's the smoking gun transcript:
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/polanskicover1.html
Honestly I regret much of what I said about that, a great deal of which was said in ignorance and a knee-jerk I-like-his-movies silliness.
I do think it's irritating when people act like Polanski himself confessed (he did plead guilty, but as a plea bargain for a reduced sentence, which bargain was reneged upon by the judge--which is why Polanski fled), or like the horrifying part of the whole thing is that Polanski had sex with a minor (rather than the likelihood that he raped someone, regardless of age). And, again, the delight many people take in punishing people is sickening to me, regardless of what the person has done.
Why run away though? There's such a thing as appeals.
I'm sorry...I really don't feel the need to rehash it any further. Like I said, I think most people's takes on it (mine included) were wrong, in various respects. I sympathize with anyone's urge to avoid imprisonment, and that's all I really have to say about it.
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